music theory

[concertjunkie]

since I have a lot of extra time up here at school, I've been practicing a lot more on guitar
however I feel I am not progressing, or I'm just fucking impatient
I keep getting told to learn scales and fuck around with that to improv, and there are some things that I'm lost as far as music theory goes

first off, which scales should I learn/know? and I guess learning how to implement pieces of those into playing is another necessity

second, how did you guys/girls (if any play guitar) learn theory? was there a certain book or teacher that explained it best?

what would be considered an effective practice method?

and I know I have more things I'm kinda stuck on, but I'll get to that later.

Lastly, what is an effective way to use a metronome for speeding up picking and playing? this may sound dumb, but I feel like I am not using it correctly...

any and all help is appreciated

[Pwnsauce]

http://www.samash.com/catalog/showit...ffiliateID=330

and learn modes

[SlipkyesBass]

on scales, start with major and minor, and pentatonics. you should learn how to construct them first and then start learning them on the fretboard. There are many books or internet sites you can find useful, but its always better to have a real teacher with you cause he can correct you and clear out any doubts. A teacher will also help you on when and where to use those scales.

About the metronome its not hard at all, get any excercise (millions of webpages have basic guitar excercises, just do a google search), the trick is to start slow and do constant repetitions until your fingers do the thing automatically, then speed it up ONLY A LITTLE BIT and do that day by day, patience and perseverance are neccesary, if you dont do it every day youll lose it, and if you dont go little by little speeding up youre doing nothing to improve your skill

[MustangMan311]

Learn the major and minor scales, and what differentiates them from each other.
Also, read this series of articles, and learn chord construction: http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/colum...de_part_i.html

[Dr. B1LL]

If you need any help, PM me, I'm a music major so I know this stuff. Everyone else said it, learn your major and minor scales first.

[F0RBIDDEN]

Music theory destroys creativity. I've spent the last 4 years trying to untrain my fingers from wanting to play the "right" notes all the time... It's good stuff to know because it can help you learn things a lot faster by ear and stuff, but it's taken me a long time to try and break free from the patterns and rules that were lodged in my head from studying it so much.

[SHRED6STRING]

forbidden is right,i mean most of my friends that are all great guitarist are all theory/schooled taught at an early age.they all tell me i'm a very "unconventional" player,whatever that means really????? but they all tell me my riffs destroy theirs because i'm so "out of the box thinking".it's a compliment i suppose but at the same time i would love to shred like a few of them.i will say the more scales i learn and practice lately the more uninspired i have become at writing music,so go figure.

[FecalFamine]

? post some samples of your riffs so I understand

[Dr. B1LL]

Originally Posted by F0RBIDDEN

Music theory destroys creativity. I've spent the last 4 years trying to untrain my fingers from wanting to play the "right" notes all the time... It's good stuff to know because it can help you learn things a lot faster by ear and stuff, but it's taken me a long time to try and break free from the patterns and rules that were lodged in my head from studying it so much.

lol wut

Music theory is what music is. It's the study of how music works. If you're stuck going to what the "right notes" should be then you're a tool. Why is it that most (hence the key word "most") guitarists think that they can be a phenomenal guitar player without music theory? You're always using some form of chord progression, it might just be a bit more advanced then what you know. To say that what you're doing is beyond the rules of theory is retarded. There's always a way to label something with musical notation.

[Lazzari]

Originally Posted by F0RBIDDEN

Music theory destroys creativity. I've spent the last 4 years trying to untrain my fingers from wanting to play the "right" notes all the time... It's good stuff to know because it can help you learn things a lot faster by ear and stuff, but it's taken me a long time to try and break free from the patterns and rules that were lodged in my head from studying it so much.

+1,000,000.00 !

[untitled]

music theory only destroys creativity if you let it.




that being said, its all about improvising and application.
for speed put your metronome on and treat each beat as a quarter note, and practice 16th notes

[F0RBIDDEN]

Originally Posted by Dr. B1LL

lol wut

Music theory is what music is. It's the study of how music works. If you're stuck going to what the "right notes" should be then you're a tool. Why is it that most (hence the key word "most") guitarists think that they can be a phenomenal guitar player without music theory? You're always using some form of chord progression, it might just be a bit more advanced then what you know. To say that what you're doing is beyond the rules of theory is retarded. There's always a way to label something with musical notation.

I'm completely aware. My point still stands that studying diatonic melody and harmony doesn't foster any extra creativity at the bare minimum. When I'm writing riffs, my brain doesn't let me play 3 chromatic notes in a row because I already "know" that it's going to sound "bad" so it's not natural for me to do that sort of thing during improvisation. Someone who knows no music theory whatsoever is not going to have any traditional concepts in their head that might influence their note choice, that's all I'm saying. Yes I'm aware that anything can be written with notation and expressed theoretically, but I still believe that it is more natural for someone with extensive theoretical knowledge to play melodies and progressions that are a bit more traditionally "correct" than it is to just rip out some bizarre off the wall note pattern that would only be explained by theory AFTER the fact when you are trying to figure out WHY it sounds good or how it sounds the way it does, instead of playing it that way because you understand the theory behind it in advance.

[SlipkyesBass]

Originally Posted by F0RBIDDEN

When I'm writing riffs, my brain doesn't let me play 3 chromatic notes in a row because I already "know" that it's going to sound "bad" so it's not natural for me to do that sort of thing during improvisation.

you are a tool. I have a friend who has studied music all his life (hes 50 years old) and teaches guitar lessons and when he writes songs he does 3 chromatic notes in a row all the friggin time, as said before everything in music has a theoretical explanation, you just need to go as deep as you can to understand it, the chromatics in a row is called blues btw.

and at the end of it all, with ot without music theory your ear will (should) always be your final judge, i mean if you can play well without theory thats great, but saying that learning how your instrument works holds you down really makes no sense to me

[Willith]

Originally Posted by SlipkyesBass

you are a tool. I have a friend who has studied music all his life (hes 50 years old) and teaches guitar lessons and when he writes songs he does 3 chromatic notes in a row all the friggin time, as said before everything in music has a theoretical explanation, you just need to go as deep as you can to understand it, the chromatics in a row is called blues btw.

and at the end of it all, with ot without music theory your ear will (should) always be your final judge, i mean if you can play well without theory thats great, but saying that learning how your instrument works holds you down really makes no sense to me

Exactly.......well except the blues thing.
Theory doesn't destroy creativity. It can help you out- especially if you're a "by-ear" player. If you can't figure out what you're looking/listening for- theory can help you potentially figure out that piece of the puzzle.
In my case, theory has helped far more, than hindered.
You can be well versed in theory and play 3, or 4, or 7, or 11, or 29 chromatic notes in a row. If that's what YOU are looking for. It's not "wrong". Don't forget, even Bach used notes outside of the key and chromatic notes. There is no "wrong"- and that's one of the biggest misconceptions that comes from people who don't know music theory.
If you're writing a chorale or something, sure I guess you might want to abide by some rules. But for fucking death metal or any sort of metal- get a grip.

[SlipkyesBass]

Originally Posted by Willith

Exactly.......well except the blues thing.
Theory doesn't destroy creativity. It can help you out- especially if you're a "by-ear" player. If you can't figure out what you're looking/listening for- theory can help you potentially figure out that piece of the puzzle.
In my case, theory has helped far more, than hindered.
You can be well versed in theory and play 3, or 4, or 7, or 11, or 29 chromatic notes in a row. If that's what YOU are looking for. It's not "wrong". Don't forget, even Bach used notes outside of the key and chromatic notes. There is no "wrong"- and that's one of the biggest misconceptions that comes from people who don't know music theory.
If you're writing a chorale or something, sure I guess you might want to abide by some rules. But for fucking death metal or any sort of metal- get a grip.

totally agree, i believe if you have very little theoretical base it definitely holds you down, cause if you think major and minor are the only ways to go then you can say the theory destroys your creativity, but a well studied musician knows all the ways to go around and knows why it sounds good to your ear. Again, your ear is always your final judge, theory just gives a name and helps you recognize and identify more easily all that crazy shit you do with your fingers

[SHRED6STRING]

well now that you say all this,can we hear some of your music? i've heard forbidden's and his playing is pretty tight.not trying to call you out or anything just really wondering if your playing measures up to your shit talk?

[Froren]

Originally Posted by SlipkyesBass

totally agree, i believe if you have very little theoretical base it definitely holds you down, cause if you think major and minor are the only ways to go then you can say the theory destroys your creativity, but a well studied musician knows all the ways to go around and knows why it sounds good to your ear. Again, your ear is always your final judge, theory just gives a name and helps you recognize and identify more easily all that crazy shit you do with your fingers

Exactly. Music theory really just allows you to understand why certain things sounds good (or bad) to your own ears. It also makes it easier to reuse things that you like the sound of because you can identify them.

[SlipkyesBass]

Originally Posted by SHRED6STRING

well now that you say all this,can we hear some of your music? i've heard forbidden's and his playing is pretty tight.not trying to call you out or anything just really wondering if your playing measures up to your shit talk?

is that with me? why shittalk? im not insulting anyone or messing with anyone, just stating my opinion, i never said "who doesnt know theory sucks" or anything. and about hearing my stuff Id love to but i still have to repare my old pc where i have all my compositions, here i have nothing. and I am not very studied in theory either, i know basics. Earlier I mentioned a friend who is really studied and is the proof that theory does not hold you down, not me. chill down man no one is fighting here

[stabwound]

Not this thread again...

[Smutlord]

You have to know the rules before you can break em!

[Dr. B1LL]

completely unnecessary bump

[That One Guy]

I just took music theory in high school, that pretty much did it for me.

[SlipkyesBass]

Originally Posted by Smutlord

You have to know the rules before you can break em!

touche

[stabwound]

Originally Posted by Smutlord

You have to know the rules before you can break em!

What rules?

[Smutlord]

Zappa was a master at TASTEFULLY breaking all of the rules. Think about it! I guess you could just play ass and have no reason or understanding why.